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'No End In sight: Iraq's Descent into Chaos'
hive29huney
March 18, 2008
12:58 PM PDT
I hadn't heard or thought of the needed addendum to the golden rule: "(unless you're a masochist)." Very wise addition!

And yes, that sounds like something Ralph Nader would say, quoting an old Chinese saying that impels us to act.

Have an excellent life, Grassroots! As always, your posts are very well written, and have many little gems in them. Your enthusiasm and energy are rather uplifting indeed.



Grassroots
March 18, 2008
5:19 AM PDT
"We weren't paying attention, being too busy and preoccupied with our own endless appetites to care, and now we're paying for relinquishing our minds and hearts to this callous, incompetent 'expert' opinion(s)." (hive29huney)

Hey hive! You are right,and thanks for elaborating on the "dunce" theme.
I see your point,and agree.I could call Monsieur Bush a 'nut-job',but that would be disrespectful toward the squirrels in my garden and NATURES own protein! LOL!

Ralph Nader,a wonderful egalitarian,author,common-sensical gentle man,and VERY UNDER-VALUED as a politician always correctly,quotes an old Chinese saying,
"To know and not to do,is not to know."

Not to "do" the right,humane thing,when one is TOTALLY aware of it,to me,is the ethical,moral and legal crime/sin.
And,to not "know" is just sheer personal,social,spiritual negligence and human indifference. Which as you say is often worse,bordering on social and moral suicide.
We are SO LUCKY to be surrounded by history,science,example,technology,text.
All of which,if we utilize our conscience and COMMON-SENSE,can drop good information and wisdom IN OUR LAPS,should we need it,in an instant.LOL!
Feed the mind,listen with respect,debate from the heart,enrich the soul.
There is no excuse to NOT KNOW!
It doesn't wash any more,when people say,"Hey don't blame me,I didn't know"
I have never believed in the 'principle' of "Ignorance is bliss" and shudder when I hear that term. Especially when voluntary ignorance can be the biggest weapon of mass destruction!
I suppose what I hate most,is an elected(selected)leader/guide and NATIONAL MENTOR,who knows that,their deeds are,and the road is,WRONG! Especially when there are safer alternatives!
Yet still,they go ahead and direct the 'traffic',of the naive,unknowing,vulnerable and YES,sometimes blind and coldly UNCARING population,along a treacherous road,INTO that 'blissful' ignorance called a DEAD END!
To me,if I end up in a dead end,it's probably MY fault because I didn't listen to my instincts,DO or learn more before I 'hit the road'!
Questions & answers,checks & balances,deeds and consequences.
By the way,I adore Mark Twain. His eloquence and humour shine a light on very dark corners of life as we often MAKE it! He really stirs the mind and conscience.

When I was growing up,my parents also held fast to some of the similar principles you speak of:
"Waste not-want not".
"Manners maketh man"
"Always eat yer' greens"
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."(Unless you are a masochist)
"Give back more than you take"
"Never be afraid to RESPECTFULLY disagree".
"Everything,in moderation"etc,etc.
We were brought up to respect frugality,and not take anything for granted.
Not because we were poor and HAD to be so.
Rather,because it was ethical and moral not to be selfishly excessive and wasteful.
It was the healthy norm,and many people enjoyed a good life,on much less(by choice),and STILL managed to enrich ALL senses,and maintain,as you say,a better "karma" and balance.
Not to mention be physically MUCH healthier(pre-disposing genetics excluded),
mentally more alert,socially more affable,culturally more tolerant and spiritually more appeased. Now that's what I call,"the good life"!

LOL! Perhaps we "strain" so much,huney-bee,because we are so CONSTIPATED by over-consumption of the wrong'STUFF'? LOL!
May I humbly offer,that right now,we are generally,as a Nation,CORPORATELY and politically constipated? LOL!
Nothing is moving in the right direction!!!
Ergo,change in National mindset,deed and intake,is ESSENTIAL to healthy holistic survival!
Time for some tea!



hive29huney
March 17, 2008
10:02 PM PDT
Hey Grassroots, thanks for that (once again) eloquent, comprehensive-but-detailed summation on the criminality of our "leaders."

The reason, however, that I called Bush et. al. a "dunce" is that for me, the "leader" is never separate from those whom he "leads." A population that puts the blame for its problems on those whom it it has showered the blessings of rule is -- in effect -- saying, "We weren't paying attention, being too busy and preoccupied with our own endless appetites to care, and now we're paying for relinquishing our minds and hearts to this callous, incompetent 'expert' opinion(s)."

I mean, if think about it, the question inevitably arises: do responsible people really allow others unquestioned authority over their lives in the first place? Only if they're acting stupidly -- in which case the leaders whom they support will inevitably do stupid things. It is karma, natural law etc. in a nutshell.

(And it is not ignorance, except in the absolute sense. I have argued gently, and moderately, for years with many friends, family, and acquaintances, both on the practical level, and on the "spiritual" level about the waste of war, of imperialism, and of consuming far more than they need etc. . . . and gotten absolutely nowhere. I have put my time and effort into producing as much of my own energy and heat as I can, and only gotten help when I pay premium prices for it. Very few -- except those who were already aware of the whole situation, have followed my example, even in small ways. "Waste not, want not" is a phrase they're eternally oblivious to.)

If the population had long ago listened to either their own intuition, conscience, intellect, and/or to others that have these qualities in some measure, they would have moderated their consumption, treated others "as they would have others treat them" (as the good book says, which they're always thumping), and taken the many steps necessary to both conserve and produce their own energy (as much as possible), without straining. Likewise, instead of just blaming others for their misfortunes --however valid such blame may be -- they would be objective enough to share the blame for trusting these idiots, con-artists, assholes. One of Mark Twain's most famous novels, HUCK FINN, expresses this idea too, to a great degree -- those who let themselves be led by the nose deserve what they get.

I'm not at all without sympathy and charity (in fact, I think I've had too soft a heart on many occasions and have lived to regret it). Sympathy and charity must be met with some commitment and intelligence by those upon whom I shower it, or be cut off (NOTE: I am referring primarily to individuals, nor organizations, though the latter is included too).

And it isn't always those whom I give money to that are to blame. Example: say I quit giving to an environmental organization -- not because of THEIR behavior, which may be very well be above reproach, but because the people who both do the polluting -- and the "surrounding citizenry" who don't care to slow or stop it, are so irresponsible that it renders all the organization's efforts a complete waste of time, like trying to fill a bucket with a huge hole in the bottom.)

I use to have this same friendly discussion with my late friend, Don Douglas, back in the early nineteen nineties, a libertarian like I was then, who would say repeatedly that it "wasn't stupidity" on the part of the leaders. And I would explain that I meant it in from an absolute level -- wasting money, lives, resources etc. is VERY STUPID, and thus those who do it are stupid people, even if it may appear that they are evil geniuses and are "winning."

This is why I have my own reservations even about Link TV, whom I contribute to every month -- why haven't they already had fund drives for buying their own solar or wind etc. system installations? It makes no sense to talk about how necessary it is to save the planet, to prevent war, pollution etc., and then not do anything to stop it in one's own life -- especially when some of us who are happy to help them pay for it by making special contributions ourselves. I already contribute to Sustainable Harvest International (which helps Central and South Americans setup bio-gas digesters, farm organically, build efficient stoves, use small solar systems etc.), and Trees, Water, People (which helps Native Americans to set up solar systems, catch rainwater, heat with solar themal etc. etc. etc., and also for those South of us). I would be happy to help Link TV on the financial side, especially since they operate in a state where net metering, subsidies are available, and certified installers are far more numerous than in many other areas.
(to Link TV: HINT HINT HINT HINT!)

Enjoy!
Grassroots
March 17, 2008
9:41 AM PDT
Hear! Hear! 'bee'hive!
The only problem is,I have doubts about Bush and ANY of his cohorts being "dunces",who REALLY DIDN'T know,
what turmoil would ensue in Iraq,
and how many lives woud be lost and,
how EVERYTHING would 'balance'(in their twisted 'oily' minds)out to achieve THEIR Corporate 'mission'.
They had spent too many years working up to this,studying this and working out how to make it APPEAR 'above board'.
They even hired the 'correct' looking people and experts/advisors(National) to prepare their war-cost previews eg. ORHA. These peoples reports and strategies could have SAVED MANY LIVES, much money and manpower and our kids could have been home BEFORE NOW!
Then,very conveniently,when enough time,paper and good solid manpower had been wasted,they bring in corporate scum like 'Hell'Paul Bremmer to VOID and negate all the work and good advise of ORHA et al,and ALLOW,knowingly,Iraq to slide into looting,sectarian death and indefinate mayhem. The word 'indefinate' being very poignant to them.
I do not think that the CPA of Bush,Cheney,Rumfeld,Rice,Kissinger,Bremmer,Wolfowitz are political dunces.
MILITARY DUNCES YES,DEFINATELY! Bu why do they have to be good militarily,when they where 'banking' on MAYHEM?
They made our good patriotic,loyal,naive,soldiers and military leaders into lap-dogs,by usurping the esteemed title of 'Commander-In-Chief',and UNDERMINING the strategic intelligence of our REAL military men of experience and honour.
My father was a proud military officer,POW'd/Escaped 3 times(North Africa-Germany) and he would not have recognized Bush's undeserved title of CIC.
He had too much respect for The Geneva Conventions and REAL Rules Of War.
Not 'excuses' for illegal occupation and torture!
I wish THEY WERE dunces,because at least there would be SOME EXCUSE to appease MY conscience,as a patriotic citizen,a humane spiritual person,and believer in DIALOGUE before bombs. But I don't think we have EVEN that excuse.
THEY KNEW EXACTLY what they were doing. NO EXCUSES!
The people who didn't know it,were our OWN BOYS AND GIRLS, who were thrown into the 'lions den' of Iraq,that Bush,Cheney,Rice and Rumsfeld CREATED.
Because,before they put their 'play' on stage,the Iraqi people were pretty 'passive' poor and downtrodden(if proud)LIONS,due to trade/oil embargoes etc. Saddam HATED AL Qaeda.
By destroying Iraq's infra-structure,and creating an EVEN BIGGER ethnic cleansing through a contrived civil war (and the CPA darn well knew the tribal complexities!)the Bush 'oil cartel' gave themselves an extended period in Iraq,and excuses then,to intimidate their BIGGER target IRAN!
(Though I still think that Bush and Ahmadinejad are bossom-buddies really,if not TWIN BROTHERS!)LOL!
Iran is certainly an OLD FRIEND of BP SHELL(One of the bidders for present day Iraqi Oil)!
Right now the similarities between Iran under Ahmadinejad,and America under 'Arbusto'Bush ARE unbelievably scary.
Hum? I wonder why?
Hellfire! Even their ELECTION system is equally as farsical AS OURS! lol!
They both do EVERYTHING they can to rig the elections and totally UNDERMINE the votes OF THE REAL POPULATION,that often desires change and improvement from the old (extinct)Dinosaur regimes!
So, do you honestly think that Bush,Cheney,Rumsfeld(Gates),Rice are going to fiscally 'equip'(or unequip),to the 'merry tune'of 3 trillion of OUR DOLLARS,their 'crusade' in Iraq, AND NOT USE THAT CHANCE,manpower,hardware,weaponry and convenient MAYHEM,to APPARENTLY threaten Iran,while they are ON THE VERY DOORSTEP?
They have SO MUCH on their corporate agenda AND they only have until the end of THIS YEAR!
By being in Iraq,Bush instantly gained a military geo-strategic base,
AND,a very handy American military BUFFER ZONE between Iran and fellow 'occupier' Israel.
And the other advantage was that American troops(and private mercenaries)are NOW guarding,in Iraq,the OIL PIPELINES that will link Afghanistan,Iran,Iraq,Jordan, ISRAEL,Libya and Turkey blah,blah,blah!
There is ALREADY an old pipeline between Iraq and Israel,(from 3 decades ago)out to the Mediterranean sea that has lain redundant for years.
Jeeez!They can just spray a can of WD-40 on that and IT'S UP AND PUMPING!

The more I read,study,hear and think about it,the more my common-sense tells me that while the ordinary American and Iraq people are enduring this mess,and loss of beloved life,and saying 'what went wrong?',
Bush's damn CPA are rejoicing that their filthy "mission" is going as planned!
That makes my soul weep!
And don't get me started on Clinton! That b*****d gave more attention to Monica
while thousands were dying under his favourite foreign dictators,and he did ONLY the minimal,superficial things for Americans,to keep HIS head above legal' and moral water,while others were being RENDITIONED,WATER-BOARDED AND FAR WORSE by America OR 'PATSIES' of America!
It was Clintons signature that authorized "extra-ordinary Renditions" that BECAME so ORDINARY in the Bush dictatorship!
The thought of that man(Clinton) walking back into OUR White House,horrifies me.
And I don't care whether it's only as First 'ungentlemanly'Gentleman, to Hilarity Rule-em Tin-Clone!
He's part of the 'stink' of Americas smelly political past to present.
And it takes a REALLY good spring-clean to get the stench of those smells out of OUR dark White House woodwork!
And now the photo-ops of Bush's lap-dog McCain landing in Iraq!!!
Totally nauseating,and he still reminds me of Mussolini.
Not Dunces 'bee'hive, blame ole' blatant all-knowing WAR CRIMINALS!
If Bush wants to know the latest terrorist?
Hey! Just look in the mirror DUBYA! IF YOU DARE!


hive29huney
March 17, 2008
5:41 AM PDT
That was excellent, Grassroots, as are your other comments I've read.

Like a lot of people, I've been completely shocked by G. W. Bush's reign of terror.

Though hardly anything to boast about, it did seem that before Bush's first "election" that some progress, however meager, had been made during Clinton's tenure.

Though I was never very impressed with Clinton, I had to rejoice when -- during the last years of his presidency -- he reversed the military support for the Indonesian dictator, Suharto, that the US had given since the Ford administration. Likewise, though Clinton failed in so many areas to live up to any democratic, populist, or libertarian ideals, he did allow local prosecutors a little more leeway in sentencing of "low-profile" drug offenders. (This however, was probably only a utilitarian response to the fact that prisons were so grossly overcrowded due to the mandatory minimum laws, and not any real or sincere desire to reform the drug war, or mitigate its huge casualty list).

And this is perhaps the worst legacy of Bush -- that he has been so horrible that it has made all our previous presidents, and their policies, look much more humane, dignified, and responsible than they actually were. He is truly the quintessential dunce, who -- by his abnormal and gross stupidity, profligate recklessness, and profound aggression -- has somehow raised a class of mediocre predecessors to a level of respectability heretofore unthinkable. He (and those who support him) have so lowered the bar on intelligence that I don't see how we'll ever really recover (not that we were doing all that great anyway!).

Of course, another way of looking at it is that Bush is the inevitable and ineluctable result of all those previous administrations --the crowning achievement
of the innumerable lies, hate, incompetence and endless compromise that have characterized this country from its inception.
Grassroots
March 16, 2008
3:34 PM PDT
If there are any fellow Americans out there,who still do not believe that Bush,Cheney,Rumsfeld,Rice should NOT be impeached for war crimes and National Adminstrative Negligence,I would advise them to see THE FULL Ferguson's and Gibney documentary,'No End In Sight'.
If you are an American who loves your country,as I do,and you watch this,you will know in your heart and soul,that Bush,Cheney,Rumsfeld,Rice et al should be in ONLY ONE PLACE,the International War-Crimes Court.
It's difficult to accept that your own White House administration,Pentagon and corporate media should lead it's citizens DELIBARATELY over a steep,and high cliff of filthy deception,leading to the deaths of many of our loved ones. But it DID!
-3,000 on 9/11,killed by negligence,by refusing to ACT on information 'secretly'garnered the previous July/August,and NOW,
-4,000 more dead Americans in Iraq and
-40,000+ maimed and traumatized war veterans coming home TO WHAT?
-and,the truth that Saddam Hussein had NOTHING to do with 9/11 and actually DESPISED Osama Bin Laden himself!
And these figures do not even include Afghanistan,OR THE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of Iraqis and Afghanis who have died or been maimed.
After watching the documentary,I wondered,
"God,what the hell have we done? Wasn't Vietnam enough?"
"How do we ever make it up to them to salvage our OWN INTEGRITY and conscience?"
How do we,Americans,admit to ourselves AND PUBLICALLY,that we were duped to our massive cost and the corporations MASSIVE,NAUSEATING PROFIT!
And,which foxhole is Osama Bin Ladens body ALREADY frozen-wrapped and pickled,READY and waiting for the right pre or peri-ELECTION day,to 'show' the world,that ALL THE LIES WERE 'WORTH IT'?
Of course,he HAS to be dead otherwise he might let it slip how MUCH he was paid,and by whom!
How many lives IS the,virtually untapped,Iraqi Oil WORTH!
and how many more years of death,hatred and injury just to fill OUR GREEDY ARSED GAS TANKS?
Do you all remember the post WW2 war-crimes tribunals?
I do,and my soul and conscience tell me,that because of this ILLEGAL MILITARY OCCUPATION and MISUSE of The Geneva Conventions,it's time FOR MORE!
Thankyou Ferguson and Gibney for 'No End In Sight'.